[FX.php List] Ajax & server load?

Joel Shapiro jsfmp at earthlink.net
Fri Oct 12 16:56:01 MDT 2007 

Hi Steve

Your long winded reply is indeed much appreciated ;)

After reading it, I did test the load-time difference when bringing  
in the additional data right from the start, and surprisingly it was  
only .3 - .4 seconds slower to load the page (less than half a second  
slower)!

I recognize that in production these times will be different, but it  
sure seems to point to not much more overhead -- and just once per  
session -- and then I'll be able to enjoy the luxury of instant local  
tooltips.

I did like the idea of everything being "Web 2.0", but I think I'll  
be happier with better performance while running in "Web 1.5" ;)

BTW- Yes, I'll be putting the tooltip content into hidden divs.  I've  
seen some JavaScript tooltips that do just that... I just need to  
find them again after all my efforts on those Ajax tooltips :-P

Thanks,
-Joel


On Oct 12, 2007, at 3:05 PM, Steve Winter wrote:

> Hi Joel,
>
> Strangely enough this idea that you came up with as an 'after  
> thought' was
> what I was thinking as I was reading through your original post... ;-)
>
> I have no solid facts to base it on, but my gut feeling is that with
> potentially so many links that can gain mouse focus, that the  
> number of
> calls to the db is going to make the tool tips load quite slowly  
> once you
> start to get several users on at once...
>
> Like you, I really like the Ajax idea of not having to have a bunch  
> of radio
> buttons and a submit, but that it all works through links via Ajax...
>
> Perhaps as a way forward the thing to do is build the 'ideal'  
> situation that
> you described in the original post, with the Ajax calls for each mouse
> focus, and see how it goes... if it ends up being too slow, with so  
> many db
> hits, then 'fall back' to the position that you've outlined here,
> potentially putting in a 'page loading' icon if it gets a bit slow,  
> and load
> your tool tips into either a Javascript Array, or probably more  
> sensibly a
> series of hidden divs, which you then position as required with  
> JavaScript
> on mouse focus...
>
> I'd love to hear that you built the 'ideal' solution, and that it  
> worked,
> but as a general rule I try to reduce the number of db calls as  
> much as
> practicable... This inclination is based on a system I built about  
> a year
> ago, in which I started out with a highly distributed series of  
> tables, with
> very few relationships in FM, and was essentially building them  
> through
> multiple php calls. What I found was that with each page load  
> making 5 - 8
> db calls, and 10 simultaneous users (this was an intensive education
> programme using FM as the back end), changing pages as often as  
> once every 2
> - 3 seconds, things began to slow down dramatically... I did some
> restructuring and went back to using portals for related data,  
> dropping the
> number of hits per page to 2 - 3 and things improved significantly...
>
> I guess my concern in your situation would be that if you had half  
> a dozen
> users who were running their mouse down a column in your table,  
> which passed
> over 10 items, each of which initiated a db call, almost  
> simultaneously (and
> as far as I know with Ajax once a call is initiated you can't stop  
> it, so
> even a brief mouse-pass over one of the links will make the db hit,  
> even if
> the data is never used) then the responsiveness of the system would be
> lost...
>
> I guess the only way to know for sure is to give it a try, and see  
> what
> happens...
>
> A very long winded way to not really say very much, but perhaps  
> helpful...
>
> Cheers
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fx.php_list-bounces at mail.iviking.org
> [mailto:fx.php_list-bounces at mail.iviking.org] On Behalf Of Joel  
> Shapiro
> Sent: Friday, 12 October 2007 7:40 p.m.
> To: FX.php Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [FX.php List] Ajax & server load?
>
> Hmm... One other option but I'd have to look into load times...  I
> could possibly bring in all detail data on my initial page load so
> that tooltips display already loaded content instead of needing to
> rehit the server for each mouseOver.  There's quite a bit of text in
> the details, though, which I thought would significantly slow down
> the page load.
>
> I'll check this, but would still love your feedback.
>
> Thanks,
> -Joel
>
>
> On Oct 12, 2007, at 11:34 AM, Joel Shapiro wrote:
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> I'd love your feedback on how my intended use of Ajax might affect
>> server load & performance:
>>
>>  - A <table> with 24 cells (4x6)
>>  - Each cell has 2-15 links (120-150 total) that onMouseOver call
>> to the DB for record details (as a tooltip)
>>  - Each link when clicked edits the DB and reloads the respective
>> cell via Ajax
>>
>> Basically, this is for users to select one option in each cell.
>> Mousing over any option shows details.  Clicking an option edits a
>> record in FM via Ajax.  I like the idea that changes are instant
>> and the user doesn't need to click a Submit button for the whole
>> page.  And I like that this way I can do various checks on each
>> selection before editing the record, e.g. to make sure that option
>> hasn't already been selected in another cell.
>>
>> However, I'm wondering if all these small hits to the DB will be a
>> problem when more than a few users are using the site at once.
>>
>>  - Probably not more than 30 or so users at a time, but in theory
>> could be more (but not 100s)
>>  - 1-machine configuration (FMSA(8) & WPE), running on a new Mac
>> Mini (not sure of the RAM)
>>
>>
>> Do you think this setup will be too slow in production?
>>
>> If so, would it help much to move the record details that display
>> on mouseOver into static content, since they won't be changing
>> often in the DB?  Or is a hit to the server pretty much the same
>> whether to the DB or to static content?  (& what would be the best
>> way to make static content?  Bring those 100+ records into one
>> large php array and grab each via a GET?  Create 100+ php pages on
>> the server?  Other...?)
>>
>> Or do you think a Web 1.0 site with radio buttons and a Submit
>> Whole Page button is preferable? (yuck)
>>
>>
>> All thoughts much appreciated.
>>
>> TIA,
>> -Joel
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